2023年10月6日 星期五

Robeco’s Chow on Fed Policy, Bonds, Treasuries

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jZD0IWId6kI

 

0:00

With this structural shift, you could argue in the bond market, what is it

0:05

pricing in? I mean, yeah, the the definitely another

0:11

hike was was on the card but I think this morning was a probably you know,

0:15

quite key at least for us last night for hearing what what Mary just said.

0:21

I think it's true, though. I think for the U.S.

0:23

the long and is a much more important in tightening conditions that actually the

0:29

the shorter end. So I think there is a lot to be said

0:32

that as the curves deepens, it does help the Fed do some of that tightening

0:36

itself and may give a reason to to kind of wait and see.

0:40

And it does allow rates to stay high for longer without actually needing to move

0:44

it too much. So I thought that the statement was

0:46

actually very helpful. Right now.

0:51

I want to get your thoughts down on this inverted curve, because at its extreme,

0:55

as you would know, we were negative. Let's let's use it using the terms as an

0:59

example. You know, we were over a -100 basis

1:02

points in inverted. We're now at 31.

1:05

My first part of the question is when do you think there's an inverse?

1:10

And number two is this typically is an indication that the recession is behind

1:14

us, not ahead. Do you think the economy is now actually

1:18

improving in the US as a function of what the bond market is telling us?

1:23

I think that what we've learned this year is that the metrics that we've been

1:27

looking at in the past has actually not not worked out the way that we had in

1:31

terms of including the revision of the yield curve.

1:33

And I think what the U.S. economy is kind of showing us, and this

1:37

may be kind of quite important for both the Chinese and the and the Japanese to

1:44

be looking at is actually what these wage inflation inflation that we were

1:47

fearing the economy has actually not done that done so leads to a much more

1:52

resilient economy. So I think and I mean, this is kind of

1:56

this is a great situation for the Fed right now.

1:59

They've managed to kind of raise quite a lot of rates without cracking the

2:03

economy. There doesn't seem to be appear any

2:06

cracks. And when they have like sbv, they've

2:08

been able to manage it quite well. So actually, that leaves us should we

2:12

should give the Fed a bit of credibility for what they've managed to navigate for

2:16

us this year. Now, the the market, the bond market

2:19

itself, you know, that is a function of a more than just kind of what we

2:24

implied. There is still lots of technical

2:26

factors, including kind of long dated demand and stuff like that, which

2:30

actually also plays into the equation beyond just just expectations of of a

2:38

recession, etc.. There are also kind of other dynamics

2:40

that play well.

2:43

I wanted to ask you, there's one theory this week that part of why Treasuries

2:48

have been trading poorly was because China for years has been stepping back

2:53

its Treasury purchases. What do you think of that theory?

2:57

I mean, I think not only the not only the the the the China, but I saw other

3:05

for other central banks, too.

3:07

It is definitely you know, we've seen a much more resilience in the local

3:11

markets, a lot more emphasis even here in the region, on the local market as

3:14

well as just kind of the dollar. So I think that's a very long structural

3:19

trend which and it benefits the U.S. only when we have, you know, a real kind

3:25

of a confidence issue and the flight quality be otherwise that that

3:28

structural shift is moving away for for multiple reasons.

3:32

Right. So I think yes, I think that is

3:33

definitely a concern. And actually something that's happening

3:36

in Japan could be also quite interesting, too, in terms of them

3:39

trying to kind of bring capital back on shore for their own for their own

3:44

economy to be moving on to their kind of energy transition issues that they're

3:48

trying to deal with now. So there's a quite a lot of those other

3:52

dynamics beyond the traditional ones that we've been looking at, but last by

3:56

ten years. Yeah.

3:58

So I mean, whatever is driving the sell off, whether it's term premature trade,

4:02

positive technical or fundamental factors to you're you're still saying

4:05

it's hard not to be bullish right now when it comes to fixing up.

4:08

Just just give us the rationale behind that.

4:10

Yeah. And I think whatever's happened we've

4:13

made I mean, yes, there may be a few more highs, definitely.

4:17

And each reaching the near end. Right.

4:19

Is not going to be another whatever we face this year, we're not going to be

4:22

facing the same last year. And we've got through this year without

4:25

actually a very big crack in the U.S. economy.

4:28

And I think that should give other kind of a central basis, but be confident and

4:33

actually a bit of inflation is not that bad and it can be managed quite well.

4:36

I think the Fed was a bit behind the curve, but even that they've managed to

4:40

tackle it quite well without cracking the economy.

4:42

And this kind of should allow other central banks, including, I think,

4:46

hopefully the the DOJ to be more confident to actually release the the

4:52

the wise policy.

英文

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 0:00

隨著這種結構性轉變,你可能會在債券市場爭論,這是什麼?

0:05

定價?我的意思是,是的,絕對是另一個

0:11

徒步旅行本來就在卡上,但我想今天早上可能你知道,

0:15

至少對我們昨晚來說,聽到瑪麗剛才所說的話非常關鍵。

0:21

不過我認為這是真的。我認為對於美國

0:23

長期而言,在緊縮條件下更為重要

0:29

較短的一端。所以我覺得有很多話要說

0:32

隨著曲線加深,它確實有助於聯準會採取一些緊縮措施

0:36

這本身可能會給我們一個觀望的理由。

0:40

它確實允許利率在更長時間內保持高位,而實際上不需要移動

0:44

太多了。所以我認為該聲明是

0:46

實際上非常有幫助。現在。

0:51

我想了解你對這條倒轉曲線的想法,因為在極端情況下,

0:55

如你所知,我們持否定態度。讓我們使用它來使用術語作為

0:59

例子。你知道,我們的基數超過了-100

1:02

點反轉。我們現在31

1:05

我的問題的第一部分是你認為什麼時候會有逆?

1:10

第二,這通常表示經濟衰退已經過去

1:14

我們,不領先。你認為現在的經濟實際上

1:18

根據債券市場告訴我們的訊息,美國是否有改善?

1:23

我認為我們今年學到的是我們一直以來的指標

1:27

回顧過去,其實並沒有像我們以前那樣解決問題

1:31

包括殖利率曲線的修訂。

1:33

我認為美國經濟向我們展示了什麼

1:37

對中國人和日本人來說可能都非常重要

1:44

我們所關注的實際上是薪資通膨

1:47

擔心經濟實際上沒有做到這一點,這樣做會導致更多

1:52

有彈性的經濟。所以我想,我的意思是,這是一種

1:56

目前對於聯準會來說這是一個很好的情況。

1:59

他們已經成功地提高了相當多的利率,但沒有打破

2:03

經濟。似乎沒有出現任何

2:06

裂縫。當他們擁有像 sbv 這樣的東西時,他們就

2:08

能夠很好地管理它。所以實際上,我們應該

2:12

應該讓聯準會對他們所設法實現的目標有一點可信度

2:16

今年的我們。現在市場、債券市場

2:19

你知道,它本身不僅僅是我們所了解的東西的功能。

2:24

默示。還有很多技術含量

2:26

因素,包括長期需求之類的東西,

2:30

實際上也超越了對一個人的期望

2:38

經濟衰退等。還有其他一些動態

2:40

那個玩得好。

2:43

我想問你,本周有一個理論可以部分解釋為什麼國債

2:48

貿易表現不佳是因為中國多年來一直在退縮

2:53

其國債購買。你覺得這個理論怎麼樣?

2:57

我的意思是,我認為不僅是中國,而且我還看到了其他國家

3:05

對於其他央行也是如此。

3:07

這絕對是你知道的,我們已經看到當地的恢復能力要強得多

3:11

市場,甚至在該地區也更加重視當地市場

3:14

以及美元。所以我認為這是一個很長的結構

3:19

只有當我們擁有一種真正的趨勢時,它才會對美國有利

3:25

信心問題和飛行品質否則

3:28

由於多種原因,結構性轉變正在消失。

3:32

正確的。所以我認為是的,我認為那就是

3:33

絕對是一個問題。實際上正在發生的事情

3:36

就它們而言,日本也可能很有趣

3:39

試圖將資本帶回岸上,為自己謀利

3:44

經濟將繼續解決他們正在解決的能源轉型問題

3:48

現在正在努力應對。所以還有很多其他的

3:52

超越我們一直在關注的傳統動態,但最後

3:56

十年。是的。

3:58

所以我的意思是,無論是什麼推動了拋售,無論是術語過早交易,

4:02

您仍在說對您有利的技術或基本面因素

4:05

當談到修復時,現在很難不樂觀。

4:08

請告訴我們背後的理由。

4:10

是的。我想無論發生什麼事我們都

4:13

我的意思是,是的,肯定還會有更多的高點。

4:17

每一個都到達了近端。正確的。

4:19

無論我們今年面臨什麼,都不會是另一個,我們不會

4:22

去年也面臨同樣的情況。我們已經度過了這一年

4:25

其實美國經濟出現了很大的裂痕。

4:28

我認為這應該為其他類型提供一個核心基礎,但要有信心並

4:33

事實上,一點點通貨膨脹並沒有那麼糟糕,而且可以很好地控制。

4:36

我認為聯準會有點落後了,但即便如此,他們還是設法做到了

4:40

在不破壞經濟的情況下很好地解決這個問題。

4:42

這種情況應該允許其他央行,我認為包括,

4:46

希望司法部更有信心真正釋放

4:52

明智的政策。

中文

 

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